Behind the Curtain with Brennan Stokes - Part 4

For Good Measure, by Ensemble for These Times (E4TT)
Episode 98: Behind the Curtain with Brennan Stokes (part 4)

Looking for a way to listen to diverse creators and to support equity in the arts? Tune in weekly to For Good Measure!

In this week’s episode, we continue our conversation with E4TT Assistant Director and For Good Measure podcast cover artist Brennan Stokes. If you enjoyed today’s conversation and want to know more about Brennan Stokes, check him out here: https://soundcloud.com/brennan-stokes.

This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors, like you. Want to support For Good Measure and E4TT? Make a tax-deductible donation or sign up for our newsletter, and subscribe to the podcast!

Intro music: “Trifolium” by Gabriela Ortiz, performed by E4TT (Ilana Blumberg, violin; Abigail Monroe, cello; Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Below the Surface: Music by Women Composers,” January 29, 2022
Outro music: “Lake Turkana” by Marcus Norris, performed by E4TT (Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Alchemy,” October 15, 2021

Transcription courtesy of Otter.ai.

Co-Producer, Host, and E4TT co-founder: Nanette McGuinness
Co-Producer and Audio Engineer: Stephanie M. Neumann
Podcast Cover Art: Brennan Stokes
With assistance from Hannah Chen, Sam Mason, Renata Volchinskaya

Curious to hear a little music from our guest Ursula Kwong-Brown, who we spoke to in our most recent episode, check out the world premiere of the work she just wrote for us, which we are performing on our season opening concert November 8.

Chapters

• 0:35 Today we continue our interview with E4TT, assistant director, and for For Good Measure cover art designer, Brennan Stokes.
• 0:44 Who would you consider your mentors? Or who are you listening to today?
• 12:26 And what are you listening to nowadays?

Transcript

Nanette McGuinness  00:00
[INTRO MUSIC BEGINS] Welcome to For Good Measure, an interview series celebrating diverse composers and other creative artists sponsored by a grant from the California Arts Council. I'm Nanette McGuinness, artistic executive director of Ensemble for These Times. Today we continue our interview with E4TT, assistant director, and for For Good Measure cover art designer, Brennan Stokes. [INTRO MUSIC ENDS] Who would you consider your mentors? Or who are you listening to today

Brennan Stokes  00:36
My mentors, I was able to study with Dr. Lynn Wheeler, in my undergraduate degree. And he was a man of few words, but he was always able to kind of meet me halfway with understanding kind of my kind of really kind of redoing my piano technique. I think, you know, growing up in a house with kind of thinner walls and being being self conscious young pianists, you know, you don't want anyone to hear you practice, yes, don't listen to anything, you know, because all you know, your parents love you. And so it's always gonna, for the most part, you know, they're gonna say, oh, I want to hear you play or it sounds so nice. And then of course, and the the hypercritical young classical musician that I was already in, it's like you don't want to hear it's not the finished product. So I always had a very kind of lighter touch that he recognized and was able to kind of to shift me into, you know, weighted arms and getting you know, getting beyond the just the yes, the key technically has a stopping point. But you want to kind of play beyond the depth beyond the stopping point of the piano. And also kind of helped with the visualization kind of with that weight, kind of the truly imagine that like this, you can kind of see the sound, going to kind of exit the bottom of the keyboard. And I think kind of using sound and kind of bridging sounds together especially to create I think even smoother, dynamic changes or you know, creating a vocal line on the piano or enhancing a melodic line. So that it doesn't maybe sound quite as percussive, even if it's loud, and even if it is fast, there's still a way to make things seeing on the piano by using kind of a really nice touch. So I'm really grateful that he was able to kind of get those ideas into me. And then Asha Raboy, was my first composition professor. Just really, really accepting of the kind of a wide variety of the four of us that were in that first composition class together. And, you know, just really just being so supportive, and just so fun in helping us and giving us space to talk about our music and, and the music of our fellow classmates just very openly and honestly, and having fun and kind of he always gave us a sense that we were all kind of learning together, even though he was the professor. And it was also really fun to be able to, because he was I think the music director of the Napa Valley Symphony for 20 plus years, and had written several pieces for them and a piano concerto. And it was, was really, really great to be able to go to his kind of farewell concert of his music and turn pages for the pianist whose resounding left foot almost took mine off during a very intense part of the cadenza. And that was a moment where I learned very quickly to tuck my right foot behind the other.

Nanette McGuinness  04:05
That's very funny, because you've done a lot of page turning for us, but I don't think it's been quite as hazardous.

Brennan Stokes  04:13
So that was that was a lot of fun. And I was able to study with David Garner at the SF Conservatory of Music and be in his studio for two years. And David definitely challenged me and opened my mind. His knowledge of text and musicality, I think has really opened my mind to the sense of even time within text. And my...the first thing I ever wrote at the Conservatory was a song cycle. And the first poem that I ever set had four stanzas and the aim arrived to kind of I was I was going through and I was just, you know, excited to kind of set the text and I was going and going and go owing and I'd finally gotten, you know, there was a few bars between the second and third stanza. And remember, he immediately kind of stop the playback. And he's like, wait, wait, wait, hold on, hold on. He's like, he's like, You just gave us something really lovely. He's like, he's like, but also and then, but then we just jumped into this straightaway. And I was like, yeah, what's the problem? And he's like, he's like, but hold on. He's like, well look at the text. He's like, Well, you know, the second stanza ends here. And then the third stanza opens up violet now, then veil upon veil of evening, and he's like, you have to notice there's been a time change. And my brain just about exploded, to realizing like, Oh, these mind blowing revelations over things that were, you know, right in front of my face. But he just had such a keen observation and attention to detail about everything. And, but was from day one, I remember that first meeting with him in his office, you know, him saying, you know, alright, so you're here, you got in. Now, what do you want to do?

Nanette McGuinness  06:08
Ah!

 
Brennan Stokes  06:10
And he was just, he was just very needed, like, you know, like, what just always wanted to know, like, what projects with what or when I was gonna be very realistic timelines for you know, any larger projects I had in mind. And because I mean, he's written near about everything for large, small solo.

Nanette McGuinness  06:28
Yeah, yeah.

Brennan Stokes  06:30
So he is a man that knows that, what realistic timetables look like and the process it takes to get there. So it was just really wonderful to be able to have someone also tell me upfront, you know, I want you to write your music to the best of your ability he's like, and it's my job to weed out anything that I think sounds derivative, or if you're copying, you know,

Nanette McGuinness  06:54
Excellent.

Brennan Stokes  06:55
So he was just from day one was very upfront about making sure that my time with him was spent refining my voice and growing as as my own composer. And was always in always added, he's like, I will have many comments and observations to give to you is like, my only kind of requirement that I would like to have you do is that, you know, between lessons, you know, any comments that I make, to at least try it. And he's like, not that you have to do it. Not that it's going to be the end product, but just try it out? And I mean, I think in all but maybe one instance he was absolutely right his comments and, and observations about, "Oh, this needs a little longer" or "I'm not quite convinced about maybe the harmony that's being used here." I'm, you know, is this maybe the right sequence of things. You know, he just has a really brilliant intuition about musicality, and order and kind of all aspects of music. And more often than not, even if, in the moment, I might have felt, you know, sometimes a little like, it's like, "oh, but I like that," you know, you go back to, you know, you go back to the piece, and you you try something else out, and even if it wasn't his exact suggestion, it would spur on a new creative door would open that I hadn't thought of before. And it definitely, it made for a much better piece by the end. And he was also want to suggest, you know, save everything, save versions of the files of the pieces you make, because, like I mentioned earlier, these audio recordings, you know, I still have the audio recording that I had made of that first time, I was sketching out that very first song for my very first piece in grad school that I was very excited to write. And I listened to it. And I listened to it. I even I think a few weeks ago, I found it and I was you know, the the kind of the essence of it was it was the same but there was really you listen back and go wow, like that's like that's, that's where it started. And it's it's fun to, to watch a piece and to develop and kind of leave yourself even your own history of a piece to go back to and kind of see, you know, where it started, what, what stayed what left, what changed to where it is to have it be by the end. And David's also, again, very wise, although nerve racking experience for a composer especially those of us who are performers. We're kind of active musicians first where we're so used I think doing things ourselves performing things ourselves. And his not hard and fast rule but very, very heavily suggested of you as a composer: you have to be in the seat in the audience for the performance. Find other performers to play your music because, you know, as educational and eye opening as our personal lessons were I mean, the other half of really learning about composing that he was right was you handing your piece of music, your brainchild over to a real life musician that is not you! Who is not going to maybe intuitively understand what it is you want it to sound like.

Nanette McGuinness  10:30
Right.

Brennan Stokes  10:32
And have them look at the music and go, "What's this?" Or like, or do you know a moment of like, "Oh, yeah, well, okay." And I always told my musicians, my performers know, please, like, "I, I am giving this to you. If there's anything wrong, if there's something not intuitive, please tell me." Like do not hold back on, you know, like, if you this is your area of expertise, like I need to know what's working, what's not working. And, you know, half of what I was able to even learn further was because of taking David's advice and suggestion of always finding performers, to rehearse, to look over your music to be able to tell you "Hey, this isn't quite working or this isn't quite idiomatic, technically, this isn't comfortable." Even down to matters of engraving of, you know, if they if there were, you know, kind of courtesy accidentals needed or if there were too many courtesy accidentals given

Nanette McGuinness  11:33
Yeah!

 Brennan Stokes  11:34
If there's, you know, especially, you know, things like page turns.

Nanette McGuinness  11:37
Oh gosh, yes.

Brennan Stokes  11:39
That moment where you realize "Oh, right, it's not just like, you can't just with turn it with your mind." You're not going to you're not gonna have your own page turner on stage for you. Yeah, David, David was just a bit immense source of wisdom and a very generous giver of pearls of wisdom. Week and week out.

Nanette McGuinness  12:05
Yeah, yeah. Sounds like it was great. I've certainly heard that he's a fabulous teacher. I know him as a composer, but that matches everything I've heard. And what are you listening to nowadays?

Brennan Stokes  12:15
Nowadays, it's actually if I'm kind of circling back to, to solo piano repertoire, and almost kind of getting around to composers that I didn't get around to in my undergrad are particularly investing in Latin, classical composers. And while I had done my fair share of listening to Albeniz, Granados, and Falla kind of the big three Spanish from Spain. Realizing that like I, I have, you know, music by Villa Lobos, and Sheena Sarah and other other Latin composers that are not Spanish and realizing like I don't quite remember like, "I can't recall some of the pieces." And I'm just floored! I've just been so floored and inspired by Ginastera, Villa Lobos, specifically, the Brazilian rhythms are intense, and a little mind melting to kind of follow along in the score with the the layers of rhythm that are being being required of the pianists. And I think the just I think the great Falk nature of Ginastera has been a blast and the Latin rhythms never failed to entertain and confuse and make make the head spin a little bit and in the most awesome of ways, and a recent for me, actually, discovery was this Venezuelan woman, pianist/composer, Teresa Carreño, and just doing a little bit of digging on her, she's just, she's a she was a tour de force of justice. This figure, she was a composer, pianist, soprano, who I think was born in 1853. And I think died, maybe in the late 1910s. But she, I think, kind of from what I remember, she moved to New York. I think as a teen she met Gottschalk with an offer of a couple of weeks of being there. And he heard her perform and was like an active promoter of her. She, I think, eventually went to Europe and she met and I think even studied voice with Rossini. She had a bit of an act of leaving like opera career. She concertized she played for Abraham Lincoln in the White House.

Nanette McGuinness  14:52
Wow!

Brennan Stokes  14:53
I think Woodrow Wilson as well. So I mean, she'd had just the most extensive performance career as a pianist as a soprano, she's got I think about, I think what did it say about 70 works for a main objectives, quite a few, quite a lot of solo piano. She's got a Saranade for strings, a string quartet some vocal music. So I'm just I'm saying, I've been sitting here, especially these last couple of weeks, just really kind of doing a little bit of a dive on her music and, you know, just really just almost being upset that I haven't heard of her before.

Nanette McGuinness  15:28
Or I, my gosh, please send some of her stuff to me for us to program.

Brennan Stokes  15:34
Oh, absolutely. It's, she's, it's been such a joy to see, you know, a Venezuelan woman be such a prominent figure in the mid to late 19th century. And I think she was even at one point kind of dubbed the Valkyrie of the piano. So I mean, I think especially, you know, from, from a historical standpoint to be dubbed a Valkyrie of a piano when you I think she also she met Liszt and several other kind of, again, just I mean, composers of real lore and fame and in our classes in our world of classical music, and to have had such an amazing career, I think, was she she might have also been the a composition professor to Edward McDowell, American famous American composer who I think he dedicated his second piano concerto to. So just to realize that this is, you know, this, this woman, this Latin woman has had such a, an immense and successful career and been such an influence to, you know, to three continents worth of, of audiences is truly just, it's amazing. And then again, just that there's a little bit of upsetting that, like, I haven't, at least to my knowledge, it's she is not a figure that is more widely known about.

Nanette McGuinness  17:06
It's stunning and sad. And I feel the same way. I mean, she sounds like she was important and impressive and had a major career and very influential. And I don't think I've heard of her, and I've got pretty decent historical chops as well. So how did you find out about her? Do you remember?

Brennan Stokes  17:26
I was just kind of even doing a quick Google search on just you know, kind of famous Latin composers. And her name popped up and I just was like, Oh, I was like, her photo looked of the of the age of the mid to late 1800s. And so I figured, you know, I was very happily surprised to see her face pop up in her name, you know, to, I wasn't quite sure what I was about to discover. And then, you know, lo and behold, there's this incredible Venezuelan woman who's just as involved in the, in the world of Granada's and Tchaikovsky, and that this whole time is really magical time in music.

Nanette McGuinness  18:07
Yeah.

Brennan Stokes  18:08
And to see it even I think, in short form her just miraculous life of touring and concertizing across, you know, the kind of the, the eastern seaboard, Venezuela, and, and Europe. Wow. Is just so inspiring.

Nanette McGuinness  18:28
Absolutely. So glad you're investigating her and I can't wait.  [OUTRO MUSIC BEGINS] Thank you for listening to For Good Geasure, and a special thank you to our guest, Brennan Stokes, for joining us today. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to our podcast by clicking on the subscribe button and support us by sharing it with your friends, posting about it on social media, and leaving us a rating and a review. To learn more about E4TT, our concert season online and in the Bay Area, or to make a tax deductible donation, please visit us at www.e4tt.org. This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors like you. For Good Measure is produced by Nanette McGuinness and Ensemble for These Times and designed by Brennan Stoke, with special thanks to co- producer and audio engineer Stephanie M. Neumann. Remember to keep supporting equity in the arts and tune in next week "for good measure." [OUTRO MUSIC ENDS].