For Good Measure, by Ensemble for These Times (E4TT) Episode 35: Juhi Bansal (part 2)
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In this week’s episode, we talk to Juhi Bansal about her experiences as a composer and a conductor, and her thoughts on building connections between audiences and contemporary music. If you enjoyed today’s conversation and want to know more about Juhi Bansal, check her out here: juhibansal.com. Parts of this episode originally premiered on Feb 2021, found on Youtube, click here.
This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors, like you. Want to support For Good Measure and E4TT? Make a tax-deductible donation or sign up for our newsletter, and subscribe to the podcast!
Intro music: “Trifolium” by Gabriela Ortiz, performed by E4TT (Ilana Blumberg, violin; Abigail Monroe, cello; Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Below the Surface: Music by Women Composers,” January 29, 2022 Outro music: “Lake Turkana” by Marcus Norris, performed by E4TT (Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Alchemy,” October 15, 2021
Transcription courtesy of Otter.ai.
Producer, Host, and E4TT co-founder: Nanette McGuinness Audio Engineer: Stephanie M. Neumann Podcast Cover Art: Brennan Stokes Interns: Roziht Edwards and Merve Tokar
[INTRO MUSIC] Welcome to For Good Measure, an interview series celebrating diverse composers and other creative artists sponsored by grant from the California Arts Council. I'm Nanette McGuinness, artistic executive director of Ensemble For These Times. In this week's episode, we continue our conversation with Juhi Bansal, who we spoke to in February 2022. [INTRO MUSIC ENDS]. You're both a composer and a conductor. How did you discover both paths for yourself? Has there been cross pollination between composing and conducting?
Juhi Bansal:
Sure. I, you know, I remember reading something years ago, ESA, Pekka Solomon had talked about how he started conducting. And I just, you know, I love this because this was true for me. And I think true for many composers as well. He mentioned that he wanted to make more opportunities to have his music played. And the obvious way to start doing it was to learn how to conduct and, you know, do it himself. And of course, for him, it's been this incredible trajectory. For me, it's much more low key than I think, you know, Mr. Solomon's has been, but in my case, it was that same idea of wanting to, one make opportunities to get my music out there, too. You know, I love I mean, I love new music, I love sharing new music, and I love performing other people's music. So also just getting to really, you know, as the composer, you can just kind of listen to other people's music and analyze it. But as a conductor, you really aren't, can be invested in it and kind of learn it inside out, which was something I've always loved doing. And, you know, there's something very exciting about premiering other people's work as well, and putting new pieces out there for the first time. That's something I've always loved. And, you know, there was so much cross pollination back and forth, I think, you know, you learn every time you perform, learn something, musically learn something about composition, every time you perform a new piece, it really resonates with you. So I know, in performing new pieces and conducting new pieces, I learned something from that that'll make its way into my composition. And I think, you know, there's so much overlap between how composers think and how conductors have to think, in that. You're just you're so invested in the sound start to finish, and you have to understand whatever piece you're doing, like, I'm in such a hands on way to make sense of that. I think that to really do feed back and forth.
Nanette McGuinness:
Did you always know you wanted to be a composer?
Juhi Bansal:
Oh, gosh, no, not at all. I I remember, when I was applying for college, we were still in Hong Kong at that point. And I had been taking lots of piano lessons. And I used to take voice lessons and violin, you know, lots of musical things. But I was also, I was really interested in physics and science. And at the time, I thought I was probably going to do I was going to try to do a double major in computer science and something else. And you know, I just remember looking up schools that had music programs that sounded interesting. And this kind of off the cuff deciding Well, I think I can put together a composition portfolio that doesn't sound all that hard. Talking about not knowing kind of what you're putting yourself in for was just this very weird experience of just trying to see if I could get in for a double major both and, you know, putting together a portfolio and I to this day, I have no idea how I got into USC's program for composition. Because I look at the bar that students have to make these days to get in that wouldn't. You know, I truly have no idea how I got in. But your remember, that was my first time being in the United States as well like coming from my freshman orientation and realizing that my class of composition students is for other students or three other students. And everybody else had been studying composition for many years and the hustle like I didn't know the composition was a thing you could study. It just sounded like fun. But, you know, learn very quickly. And you know, obviously, I really loved music and was excited to do it. And within the first couple of years, I realized I was more interested in the work I was doing in music than in the work I was doing in computer science. So kind of gradually let that go. And that's been my path since but it was not a very well planned trajectory at the start. It's kind of just finding yourself, letting things flow as they would.
Nanette McGuinness:
You were a staunch proponent of bringing new audiences into contemporary music. What have been the most effective ways you found to bring new listeners into the contemporary music scene. Any advice for contemporary musicians or ensembles?
Juhi Bansal:
That's a great question. And, you know, I think the answer depends a little bit on who it is that you're trying to bring in. So my experience has been, there's kind of two groups of people who I think are, have potential to be really interested in actually contemporary music, maybe they don't know it yet. One is, I think there's this group of people who really love classical music. And when I say classical, I mean really traditional Mozart, Beethoven, classical music, who either have not been exposed to contemporary music yet, or they've been exposed to it, but only like one or two styles of it, that, you know, there's a sense of what contemporary music is, which is not actually at all representative of what it is exactly. And, you know, it's a group that I think is often can often be really excited about new music, do you kind of have to figure out where they're starting from, you know, whether it's that they just haven't been exposed to new music at all, or maybe they've been exposed to some and they haven't liked the particular style or styles that they've been exposed to. And I've done a couple of projects in the past where we found things like thematic programming, for example, or like, you know, hidden programming or secret programming or just something where you kind of invite people in the door, without yet limiting. Without trying to set up any preconceived notions of what they're going to hear. Just like just an idea or theme, something to get people in the door with an open mind, I think that is often actually a really great way to bring people into music. And the other group I would say on this is actually probably by far the much larger group is kind of people who are not necessarily interested in classical music, whatever that means classical music, but people who listen to popular music to folk music to all the like normal musics of today. One of the things I think it's actually really interesting these days is that we as composers drawing so many of the same kind of tools, techniques, sounds, I think there's more crossover right now between, like stage music and non stage non concert music than probably there ever has been in the past. So I think there's a lot of room to get people understood in contemporary music, who maybe don't care about the traditional classical music at all. And it's again, that same idea of kind of finding the points of overlap. So there's a number of projects where they'll do like film. Either you know, silent film type things, or like film scores live, that just kind of, it's one way to introduce people who maybe don't have an interest in classical music into what has been written these days for buy in for contemporary musicians. But anything really where you can start making connections to again, themes or good idea events that are about more than just more than just the music on the stage, just like a broader event or broader story abroad or festival are great ways to get people in the door. Because I've been surprised how often people get interested in new music, once they hear it, it's just getting that first hurdle. You just gotta get them to hear it the first time and find something that they like.
Nanette McGuinness:
Those are great, great ways to do it. I think the separation between the concert stage and every other music that's made is a very 19th century artificial concept. And before that, we didn't have a sense of really classical music versus popular music. I mean, there was a range, but the same musicians were doing it. So it's, in a sense, almost like we're returning more to what it used to be.
Juhi Bansal:
I think it's about time, even, you know, it's so interesting. We're having this conversation online, you and I and this is gonna be put digitally This is, can you give in a little microcosm exactly what we're talking about. There is no stage. There's just conversations about music and music and how people discover that I think it's actually a really exciting time to try to bring new audiences in.
Nanette McGuinness:
[OUTRO MUSIC] Thank you for listening to For Good Measure, and a special thank you to our guest, Dawn Norfleet for joining us today. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to our podcast by clicking on the subscribe button and support us by sharing it with your friends, posting about it on social media and leaving us a rating and a review. To learn more about E4TT Our concert season online and in the Bay Area where to make a tax deductible donation, please visit us at www.E4TT.org. This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors like you. "For Good Measure" is produced by Nanette McGuinness and Ensemble for These Times, and designed by Brennan Stokes. With special thanks to audio engineer extraordinaire Stephanie Neumann. Remember to keep supporting equity in the arts and tune in next week "for good measure." [OUTRO MUSIC ENDS]
You’re both a composer and a conductor. How did you discover both paths for yourself? Has there been cross-pollination between composing and conducting?
You’re a “staunch proponent of bringing new audiences into contemporary music.” What have been the most effective ways you’ve found to bring new listeners into the contemporary music scene? Any advice for contemporary musicians or ensembles?