For Good Measure, by Ensemble for These Times (E4TT) Episode 28: Dawn Norfleet (part 3)
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In this week’s episode, we talk to Dawn Norfleet about how improvisation led her into the realm of hip-hop music, and how this experience helped her to think outside of genre boundaries. If you enjoyed today’s conversation and want to know more about Dawn Norfleet, check her out here: music.columbia.edu/bios/dawn-norfleet . Parts of this episode originally premiered on January 2022, found on Youtube, click here.
This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors, like you. Want to support For Good Measure and E4TT? Make a tax-deductible donation or sign up for our newsletter, and subscribe to the podcast!
Intro music: “Trifolium” by Gabriela Ortiz, performed by E4TT (Ilana Blumberg, violin; Abigail Monroe, cello; Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Below the Surface: Music by Women Composers,” January 29, 2022 Outro music: “Lake Turkana” by Marcus Norris, performed by E4TT (Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Alchemy,” October 15, 2021
Transcription courtesy of Otter.ai.
Producer, Host, and E4TT co-founder: Nanette McGuinness Audio Engineer: Stephanie M. Neumann Podcast Cover Art: Brennan Stokes Interns: Roziht Edwards and Merve Tokar
[INTRO MUSIC] Welcome to For Good Measure, an interview series celebrating diverse composers and other creative artists sponsored by grant from the California Arts Council. I'm Nanette McGuinness, artistic executive director of Ensemble For These Times. In this week's episode, we continue our conversation with Dawn Norfleet, who we spoke to in January 2022[INTRO MUSIC ENDS]. You studied underground hip hop culture in New York City for your dissertation. What drew you to this scene for your doctoral work? And what surprised you the most in your research?
Dawn Norfleet:
I love that question. Because it seems like it was a 180. But at when I started, what was that when I finished my master's I, I actually returned to performing but because when I was working on my Masters, I for some reason, I convinced myself that I might as well not continue studies as a flutist, so I thought I'd actually put put it down for by about three years, and I would still just sort of improvise and but then when I when I changed programs, I started playing out more, just some r&b things. And eventually, I went into the jazz scene, actually, about the same time that I was getting more into my work now, why hip hop, it was not my first language. Growing up, I grew up with bands, and specifically, rhythm and blues and funk bands are on fire and Stevie Wonder and Steely Dan, even though they're you know, that's it's sort of progressive, whatever you want to call it. But But what fascinated me about hip hop was the idea of improvisation, I had no idea that improvisation took place in hip hop culture. So it was actually a course assignment that drew me in, I found a, a club at a, at a middle school, it was like a hip hop and poetry club. And so they're like this group of like, you know, 11 and 12 year olds, are just freestyling mean, improvisation, they were improvising. And I was just really amazed, I had never heard that heard of that before. And so, so, I asked more people around me, it turns out that a friend of a friend was heavily into hip hop culture, and introduced me to other people in the scene. And then I found that improvisation was actually a very important part of that underground cultural scene, that has nothing to do with what people really hear on the radio and the popular songs. So improvisation is was what drew me in to, to, to studies in hip hop culture.
Nanette McGuinness:
Have under underground hip hop culture and your research about it influenced your own music?
Dawn Norfleet:
Yes. Yes, I would say so. There is something about a big bass sound that is that just makes me feel good. And yeah, so I'd say just a fullness actual fullness or something, you know, I, I aim to use like the entire instrument to get whatever it is get the full Yeah, yeah, yeah. So and I also now this this isn't necessarily Hip Hop roll related, but just sort of the way my mind works. I love groove and I love poly rhythm poly polyphony in general. I'm a huge fan of Monteverde. Yeah, yeah. Oh my gosh. Yeah. So all of that chugs along is soul music. To me, it's just it's just beautiful. And I'm just like all into it so. And I felt that when I was in grad school groove was something you tried to get away from. And now I am I embrace it, you know, the stuff with Grove stuff without growth, just wherever my my imagination wants me to go. That's what I that's where I go. And I'm not as restricted by such boundaries. Like, boundaries. Yeah, genre boundaries, tonal boundaries, metric boundaries. Like I have a jazz piece and 21 Eight. Wow. And it's and it's a groove. And it's a groove. So then my orchestra piece isn't large largely and five. Actually, it is all its Yeah, and five, eight. So
Nanette McGuinness:
[OUTRO MUSIC] Thank you for listening to For Good Measure, and a special thank you to our guest, Dawn Norfleet for joining us today. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to our podcast by clicking on the subscribe button and support us by sharing it with your friends, posting about it on social media and leaving us a rating and a review. To learn more about E4TT Our concert season online and in the Bay Area where to make a tax deductible donation, please visit us at www.E4TT.org. This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors like you. "For Good Measure" is produced by Nanette McGuinness and Ensemble for These Times, and designed by Brennan Stokes. With special thanks to audio engineer extraordinaire Stephanie Neumann. Remember to keep supporting equity in the arts and tune in next week "for good measure." [OUTRO MUSIC ENDS]
You studied underground hip-hop culture in New York City for your dissertation. What drew you to this scene for your doctoral work? What surprised you the most in your research?