For Good Measure, by Ensemble for These Times (E4TT) Episode 25: Darian Donovan Thomas (part 5)
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In this week’s episode, we talk to Darian Donovan Thomas about being an artist during the pandemic and the importance of continuing to explore and discover his authentic compositional voice. If you enjoyed today’s conversation and want to know more about Darian Donovan Thomas, check him out here: darianthomas.myportfolio.com . Parts of this episode originally premiered in December 2021, found on Youtube, click here.
This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors, like you. Want to support For Good Measure and E4TT? Make a tax-deductible donation or sign up for our newsletter, and subscribe to the podcast!
Intro music: “Trifolium” by Gabriela Ortiz, performed by E4TT (Ilana Blumberg, violin; Abigail Monroe, cello; Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Below the Surface: Music by Women Composers,” January 29, 2022 Outro music: “Lake Turkana” by Marcus Norris, performed by E4TT (Margaret Halbig, piano), as part of “Alchemy,” October 15, 2021
Transcription courtesy of Otter.ai.
Producer, Host, and E4TT co-founder: Nanette McGuinness Audio Engineer: Stephanie M. Neumann Podcast Cover Art: Brennan Stokes Interns: Roziht Edwards and Merve Tokar
[INTRO MUSIC] Welcome to For Good Measure, an interview series celebrating diverse composers and other creative artists sponsored by grant from the California Arts Council. I'm Nanette McGuinness, artistic executive director of Ensemble For These Times. In this week's episode, we continue our conversation with by Darian Donovan Thomas, who we spoke to in November 2021. [INTRO MUSIC ENDS]. Social justice, intersectionality and inclusivity are at the core of your practice. Can you talk about your artistic vision, and whether the pandemic and the events of 2020-21 have shifted your perspective as an artist of change?
Darian Donovan Thomas:
I've always thought that anything an artist says will be taken in the context of their time. Even choose not to respond to your time still choice. And so I'd much rather be one of the artists who's responding to the things that are happening around me. It also feels like an important way to remain authentic and not to feel untethered from the world around me. Even if I'm creating things that are ethereal, dreamy, or abstract art sound for sound fake, it's still going to be grounded in the time that I'm in, right? The sirens of 2021 or 2020, in New York, and the police cars and all the channels and people and all the talking that happens around different topics of police brutality, or around the topics of COVID. This chattering frenetic energy was very much the sound world of the year. And so it wouldn't make sense to ignore it, and not put it in my art, you know. And I think the goals or the like, I found that I have a way of saying things, sometimes an art that communicates a message differently than people have heard it before. This happened with Katana brother, this happened with Stephen Clark, where I just remember a piece being premiered. And then people in the audience coming up to me afterwards and saying, I never actually thought about it that way. And it felt like they had a better understanding of what needs to be said, because there's a weird austerity and music sometimes where it can be non emotional. And it can be purely data, almost like a sonic grass. And I think sometimes that's more effective than everything that media does at the moment, because that's a whole dramatic mess. And theatrical quandary, honestly, to figure out like which media outlets I'd be listening to where should be getting resources from? Where should we be getting info from. And if I can make something really clear in art, then I would love to do that. And that feels like a good use for art as well. And then, of course, always balancing it out with making things that are, I don't know, just beautiful, like, around the same time that I made. What was it it's a disintegrating foundation under a catastrophe of air, this solo bass piece about COVID and about virtually protests all happening at the same time. I also made Florida Cemre, which is this abstract sound for sound sake, string orchestra piece. And it feels good to do both to be like I'm not person makes only one kind of art, but also very capable of making both kinds. You know?
Nanette McGuinness:
That's a great answer. I've always felt that music talks directly to the reptile part of our brain, the emotional core. And so we can talk directly to it without actually having to whack it over the head because it's al ready ready to respond. It's there.
Darian Donovan Thomas:
Right? Yes, exactly that.
Nanette McGuinness:
Any advice for aspiring or current artists, either in these pandemic times or in general?
Darian Donovan Thomas:
There are a couple things that I wish people would have told me it's like, the notion that finals week actually keeps coming back doesn't stop just in school. I just had a crazy assignment where I had to try it out like 12 songs for string orchestra in like a day and a half. And the way that yes, thank you. The way that my desk became my college desk instantly. was really funny, where I took a picture of it. There's like, my laptop, my violin is next to my laptop. The laptop has like 36 windows open. And like so many PDFs and so many smelliest files. It's confusing. I have a mug of like, tea. I have a thermos of water. I have oatmeal and a parfait and nearby there's a trash bag there. It's just a mess. But it's like this is just college again. Like totally finals legal college again. And this is not the first time this has happened since college. So I think knowing like, maybe the actual tip there is like, really learn how to deal with the periods of intense stress, because they come back a lot. Often, and then also just like to do as much as you can figure yourself out. And to be a piece of yourself, because that's where your best art is gonna come from. And they think my art got a lot better. Once I accepted, or at least was able to look at my shortcomings. Like, once I stopped being blindsided by my own self. Everything became a lot clearer. And therefore, like, what I wanted to say, became a lot clearer in my work. And it's easier to just let art happen as opposed to like making it happen. Yeah, and you know, like, going back to the beginning thing of, if you don't respond to the times around you, that's the response. And people will read into that. So just figure out how much control you want to have over how people are reading into you. And then move accordingly.
Nanette McGuinness:
That makes sense. For a long time, my mom, who is a digital visual artist refused to title her works, because she didn't want people to have a preconceived notion that she was putting on her art, but to see it for themselves. And what I think you said earlier is important about knowing yourself being authentic, and embracing who you are, then until you do that, you can't speak with your own voice, because you don't know what your voice is.
Darian Donovan Thomas:
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And it keeps going. It's like, constant exploration for the rest of your life. And the rest of my life, but that's part of the fun. Okay, it's good to know that a person won't always sound the same. No other person can change.
Nanette McGuinness:
Exactly. You get to have your blue period or your second style. Right.
Darian Donovan Thomas:
Right. Exactly.
Nanette McGuinness:
This is great. These are fabulous answers. Thank you.
Darian Donovan Thomas:
Of course. Thanks for asking.
Nanette McGuinness:
[OUTRO MUSIC] Thank you for listening to For Good Measure, and a special thank you to our guest, Darian Donovan Thomas for joining us today. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to our podcast by clicking on the subscribe button and support us by sharing it with your friends, posting about it on social media and leaving us a rating and a review. To learn more about E4TT Our concert season online and in the Bay Area where to make a tax deductible donation, please visit us at www.E4TT.org. This podcast is made possible in part by a grant from the California Arts Council and generous donors like you. "For Good Measure" is produced by Nanette McGuinness and Ensemble for These Times, and designed by Brennan Stokes. With special thanks to audio engineer extraordinaire Stephanie Neumann. Remember to keep supporting equity in the arts and tune in next week "for good measure." [OUTRO MUSIC ENDS]
Social justice, intersectionality, and inclusivity arte at the core of your practice. Can you talk about your artistic vision and whether the pandemic and the events of 2020/21 have shifted your perspective as an artist of change?